Single Men In Swinging
there are many wonderful sincere single men that seek to
be involved in responsible non-monogamy, there are two big
problems single men face.
1) The vast majority of couples only want to relate to other
couples, and especially in our group want to develop couple
to couple friendships that is much more than just sex. This
is especially true for new couples since sharing only with
other couples creates less jealousy issues.
Later they may become involved in the Lifestyle without
having to always be together with their partner but there
still is more a sense of security when they know the other
person is also in a strong primary relationship.
Also, many single men tend to want to cling to a women and
are much more desperate for sex than a couple that are already
sexually fulfilled but simply want more variety and more
friendships with others that have a strong primary relationship.
Many experienced couples have experienced this and want
nothing to do with single men based on these bad experiences.
wrote about why they only swing with couples:
"Our lifestyle implies sharing the person we love more
than anyone else in the world, with another person. Whether
married or not, a couple is a man and a women that care
about each other's well being. It is much easier to relax
and enjoy the company of others when you know that you are
with people who care about their partners. You will feel
a sense of safety and security, which we know, is important
to all of you."
balance or the "too much male energy" problem.
Since hardly any single women are interested in the Lifestyle
until they first have a partner (we get about 100 single
men asking about the group for every 10 couples and almost
no single women), we would always have to limit men. How
to select? If you feel gender balance is important this
is a serious problem. In some polyamory groups, gender balance
is not important and having lots of extra men is not a problem.
However, we believe gender balance is important and therefore
allow single men to participate only if gender balance can
We hoped to attract more single women with our interest
in intimacy not just sex. I have brought in about six women,
but they are now in other prime relationships and a couple
of them participate as couples.
Some clubs like Sociables in Phoenix, have nights single
men can come but most couples avoid those nights unless
they are into exhibitionism and enjoyed be stared at by
lots of horny single men. This is certainly not my interest
nor that of most couples. If also makes a lot of money for
the clubs to have single men nights.
We did try a single men's group and had one very good meeting.
However, we just didn't have enough leaders interested in
continuing and the numbers were very small compared to the
number of initial inquiries. When most men found out we
really didn't have zillions of women just waiting for them,
they lost interest. My interest is primarily couples and
neither Bill nor I have any time nor that much interest
to promote or even help someone else lead a single men's
group since we just are too busy with other things.
In some polyamory groups, the gender balance is not as important
since they often include many bisexual men. Bisexual women
are common in "swinging" but bisexual men have
always been at a great disadvantage due to HIV concerns,
which of course are not necessary well founded. Many bi
men have no interest in anal which is the only significant
HIV risk. But bi men mostly have to remain in the closet
in "swinging" but are more welcomed in polyamory
We are more of a poly group than swing....but we still believe
gender balance is important.
The following is a more extensive collection of comments
from others as well as my own regarding single men in "swinging":
Christians out of about 2500 people contacting us often
from ads saying we are for couples and single women only
we still get about 200 single men contacting us for information
for every 20 couples to perhaps 1-2 single women. A couple
of these women were dominatrix's looking for slaves! Only
one single women currently participates in our Fellowship
Group (out of 46 people who attended last meeting) and she
helps as a leader.
The rest are all couples and they clearly do not want single
men to offset the gender balance and who may have a different
agenda than long-term loving friendships, couple to couple.
Many women are bisexual so extra women not a problem. Very
few men are bi and most men are much more against male bisexuality,
while bisexuality among women is common and accepted by
It is important for single men to realize swinging is primarily
a couples activity. While a few "select" single
men participate, and a few couples seek them, the vast majority
of couples only want couples. There are good reasons for
this, especially where friendship and intimacy is sought,
not just recreational sex. The fact is there is a HUGE oversupply
of men compared to the very small demand. Here are some
of the reasons why single men are mostly unwelcome in swinging
One club owner said: "My wife and I have been in the
lifestyle for 13 years. We are on the Board of Directors
of one of the largest and oldest swing clubs in the country.
Our club is nonprofit so we don't go out of our way to rip-off
single guys (unlike some of the other clubs I've seen).
My personal observation on singles is that they are too
pushy... Most couples in the lifestyle avoid single guys.
Very few couples are looking for mmf threesomes. Clubs that
let single guys in in any quantity are just trying to make
a quick buck and eventually chase the couples away. To sum
up how most couples feel, is that if you don't bring a women
to the party you shouldn't be attending...Your chances of
scoring as a single guy in a swing club is very slim. And
any club that tells you different is just trying to part
you from your money". From Steve Allen on Internet.
Another club owner said in response to my single men problem
"Words of ultimate wisdom! We are a swinging couple
who runs a swinging couples only board here in Toronto.
We get a lot of single straights looking to join up with
a couple. There are couples interested in the husband watching
their wife getting it from a single male or group but they
are far and few between. Most couples who are into swinging
are looking to exchange partners for something new or as
an extension of a friendship." from Debbie Stefen,
Ontario's Swinging Couples Choice.
Single women are welcome at most clubs, but are very rare.
If women want to be the meat in the market they can go to
a bar. Most women want more intimacy and caring and only
come into swinging once in a stable wonderfully open communicative
prime relationship. Also many more women are bisexual than
men, so extra women is not nearly the problem than extra
All major swing conventions are couples only for these reasons.
Most NASCA member clubs are couples only. The Lifestyles
convention (grand daddy of all with 3000 people) has been
couples only for many years due to so many complaints when
they use to let single men attend. The vast majority of
couples are simply not interested in single men and to encourage
more unneeded males to participate is, in my opinion, a
big disservice to the majority in the Lifestyle.
More public posts about single men:
"Many couples regard single males are "sharks"
just after sex. That is not what many swinging couples want.
A single male has a very different agenda and issues than
couples. Many couples have told me of terrible experiences
where they bring in a single male for the women, and he
falls in love with her and is devastated when he can't have
her more often. Some single men tend to attach like a octopus
out of desperation. Couples want to share as friends, intimacy
with other couples without any need to be jealous since
they are centered in the prime relationship. Many swingers
are looking for much more than just recreational sex, but
intimate friendships with other couples."
As an "experienced" couple, we are continually
forced to "screen" all potential contacts because
of these asshole single/married-cheating guys that want
to horn in where they aren't wanted.
I'm sure some jerk will follow-up my post with another long-winded
reason why they should be included in our lifestyle - but
they just don't seem to get it! We don't care, we aren't
interested, you've missed the whole point and purpose of
the alternative lifestyle.
In fact, by single guys constantly trying to convince us
that they are worthy of a second look, they perpetuate their
own misery. We've been contacted by guys that couldn't get
a date with a $500 bill taped to their forehead! Listen
fellas, leave the "couples" alone and go about
finding an available female to satisfy your sexual needs
and desires and then you are no longer a single! Also, I'm
sure that the next post from some dork will claim that they've
had relationships with lots of couples.
AND FROM YET SOMEONE ELSE:
I tend to agree...why is it that the single male is so great
to party with, yet when you read their posts they're looking
for "cunts" "pussy" or whatnot...where
do they show any respect for the ladies? Having been involved
for 15+ yrs, the only "single" males we ran across
were out for themselves, the hell with everyone else...
And another couple tried to put it a bit more politely...
"We don't need any single men thank you. Sorry guys
just way too many of you out there."
And As a post to alt.swingers said: Simple fact: if you're
a single man who comes to swinging looking to get laid,
you're not likely to do very well. There are a number of
reasons for this, most of which have been rehashed _ad nauseum_.
Most of them boil down to, "If you can't find anyone
ELSE to fuck you, why should WE be interested? Is this alt.mercy.fucks
Coming on here and whining about how the Big Bad Couples
won't let you play with them because they're bigoted against
single men is not likely to get you much of anything.
Concerning the lack of single women in swinging:
Try this explanation for the lack of single women in the
Lifestyle, Any half way attractive single female that is
interested in no strings sex with a single man can walk
into any bar in America on any night of the week and find
more willing male partners than she can handle. Why in the
world would she need to waste her time in a swing club looking
for single males. Her only reason to go there would be to
look for bi-women or couples. Yet another reason that solo
males are in low demand in the Lifestyle.
Any husband in the newsgroup can tell you there is no anti-male
discrimination in the swinging community. Half of all swingers
are male and those males who are in a committed relationship
with a swinging wife have no problem gaining access to other
swingers. Solo Males who are NOT in committed relationships
need to EARN their way into the Lifestyle. If you are crying
in your beer because most clubs limit or ban solo male acts
wake up and smell the coffee. If they didn't limit the access
by solo males, the clubs would be populated by mostly guys
looking to get laid, and the couples would quit coming.
No couples = no swinging = no club. So that equals NO BIGOTRY.
Just good business sense! And of course sour grapes from
the guys that can't get past the door to get at all of the
loose women that they think are there..
The swinging Lifestyle is only discriminatory against solo
males in the way that the NFL is discriminatory against
athletes. ONLY THE BEST can hope to get in because of the
HUGE number that want to play with a limited number of teams